Curse

Whispering Siren · Aug 26, 2005, 08:40 AM // 08:40

Like anyone else, I was very excited for this weekend's PvP Xtreme event. I have played in PvP a small amount (as I have four PvE characters, one of whom is a designated pre-sear guild recruiter).

I love playing PvP, even though I'm not very experienced with it yet. All of my characters have armor and skills in-line with their level. I don't get run anywhere and enjoy actually playing PvE also. I don't have a problem, per se, with those who get run, each person has their way of playing.

My problem is this: (take the Ascalon Arena for example). Being a level 10 and having level 10 skills and armor is what that arena is for. I go in to play PvP tonight with my ranger and not two seconds into the game another ranger applies poison on me. I think you get this skill at Droknar's Forge?? My team of level 10 and under wearing ascalon armor doesn't stand a CHANCE.

This just isn't fair. The level caps on arenas are so that it's an equal playing field. So that I, as a "lower" level, can play people at the same level as me, with the same armor and same skills.

I dont' suppose running will ever or can ever be banned or nerfed. But I do have a suggestion for fixing this (and it's simple): make armor have a level requirement and make elite skills have a level requirement or even non-elite skills too! There should NOT be a level 3 in elite armor using elite skills. Or even a level 10. It's not fair to the rest of us in PvP and makes it not fun, honestly.

As someone just getting their feet wet in PvP - I barely get a chance to learn because of those who "cheat" the system and can kill me in two seconds flat.

/end rant.

(i've heard Anet monitors these forums for actual suggestions? - please let this be true).

DrSLUGFly · Aug 26, 2005, 10:25 AM // 10:25

I partially agree. I don't like the idea of armor, weapons and skills having a level requirement, but I do like the idea of the PvP arena's taking armor level and skill level into account before allowing entry.

Whispering Siren · Aug 26, 2005, 10:28 AM // 10:28

That's a good idea too. It might get more complicated than the simple level caps they have in place now.

Let Anet figure out HOW exactly, but I feel something has got to be done about it.

IPlayGuildWars · Aug 26, 2005, 11:39 AM // 11:39

Apply Poison? I don't think you get that in Droknar's Forge, my Ranger has it early on in the game, though I forget where. Now...if he Poison Arrowed..

Whispering Siren · Aug 26, 2005, 11:40 AM // 11:40

You're right, I don't know if it was apply poison. It was some sort of poison (as my health bar was green) that took my health to zero in a matter of seconds.

KelvinC · Aug 26, 2005, 11:57 AM // 11:57

no elites and forge armors at the entry of the arena. Problem solved.

Lebdan · Aug 29, 2005, 09:15 PM // 21:15

Apply Poison is found in the Ascalon Settlement. It's still far ahead from Ascalon. But it's not uncommon to see people using elites in those arenas.
There's been lots of threads about this problem, and nothing has been done. And on this last Fansite Friday, the devs answered a question about the low level arenas, and I didn't like what they said:

Quote:

GameAmp: I've always loved to see what "roles" gamers invent that were not intended by the developers upon the release of the game. One of the more popular of these roles is the game's growing population of runners that allow low level players to "hitch a ride" to the higher level zones in the game. The most popular run is obviously the Lornar's Pass run that allows a player to reach Droknor's Forge through Beacon's Pearch with the aid of a competent runner. Running has turned into a fun mini-game for a portion of the game's population but it also gives the ability for low level players to reach content they should not be permitted to access. It would be a shame to make Lornar's Pass un-runnable but "twinking" low level characters is often something that the developers address with an iron fist. Are precautions being taken to put level requirements on some of the higher level zone portals or perhaps even the armor purchased at the higher stages of the game without completely crippling the runner's ability to be unique?

Guild Wars: <etc etc etc>
In other words, to the extent that a practice like "running" or taking a shortcut might negatively affect other players, we'll be taking a look at it very carefully. If there's a lot of abuse of lower-level characters (those who are playing through the missions) by those who are taking the shortcut, we'll address it. I note that we did not choose to address the matter with last night's major game update, and I believe that is because the possible problems are not evident to such a degree that we need to make an amendment. But I just spoke with Lead Designer James Phinney, and he assured me that we will continue to assess the situation and we will come up with solutions if the scales tip towards the negative.

I guess that means the devs don't look at the forums enough.
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=51971
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=50644
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=40228
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=20656

What do you think?

EDIT: Oh right, and the suggestion I like the most is the checkpoints. It won't keep the low levels who want to rush to Droknar for their armor, but won't let them use the skills and armor from the later areas in the arena. Simply put a checkpoint in Yak's Bend and another in Beacon's Perch. Yak's avoid players from playing in Ascalon Arena and Beacon's avoid players from playing in the Shiverpeaks Arena, leaving them the Competitions Arena in Lion's Arch and Team Arena in Droknar's Forge.

The milk shake · Aug 30, 2005, 04:07 AM // 04:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by KelvinC

no elites and forge armors at the entry of the arena. Problem solved.

it wont work that well, they might as well buy the ventauris refuge armor, and there are pvp pwning skills that are not elite ex: air spikes(chain lightning), obsidian flame/crystal wave spams, u can kill a guy in 2-3 hits using the flame.

Rhunex · Aug 30, 2005, 04:25 AM // 04:25

why not just put a level 11 requirement on all armors past, say, LA? This way, people can get the uber leet armor of northern shiverpeaks, go to ascalon arena and "pwn"

and, you're not restricting anyone else, because the drok runners usually level up(eventually) and putting it on LA would be good, because it would reduce what few rushes leave from LA

Rhunex · Aug 30, 2005, 04:26 AM // 04:26

sorry, forgot to put this in my last post :/

for skills, you could do the same thing, putting a level 11 requirement on all skills past LA, so the scales arent tipped horribly

Whispering Siren · Aug 30, 2005, 08:59 AM // 08:59

lebdan, i saw that the other day. at least they SEE there MAY be a problem.... although i think it is more of an issue than they let on. and thanks for the other forum links.

level cap on skills at LA and beyond wouldn't be bad idea. as long as this is meant in the context of the order you're SUPPOSED to go in. obviously, droknar's is further (as far as story line and difficulty) and the level cap should include drok's.

i just think something needs to be done, it's ruins it.

coolsti · Aug 30, 2005, 09:25 AM // 09:25

I played in the lower level arenas a few times, to give it a try, and quickly gave up on the idea. This game sucks for this kind of thing. And the reason is how many of the participants have higher level armor and higher level skills because they got run somewhere. Or weapons, which if they weren't customized, were handed down from the player's higher level characters.

One thing that would help here is to have stronger level limits on when certain skills can be learned, which armor class can be worn, and which weapons can be used.

Lebdan · Aug 31, 2005, 04:05 PM // 16:05

I hate it how this kind of subject is ignored and someone not long after posts a new thread about this. Something has to be done about this.

Sofonisba · Aug 31, 2005, 07:38 PM // 19:38

The only thing that comforts me - and it's not much - is knowing how crippled these elite skill users/max armor wearers will be when they find themselves on EQUAL footing for once in their lives at level 20 arenas. They will not know how to win.

I have taken to referring to these folks as "dopers," equating it roughly with steroid abusers in professional sports. "Just a game..." "Anything to win..." -- same arguments, same desperate people who believe they couldn't win without the edge. Sad, really.

chaos dragoon · Aug 31, 2005, 08:08 PM // 20:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rhunex

why not just put a level 11 requirement on all armors past, say, LA? This way, people can get the uber leet armor of northern shiverpeaks, go to ascalon arena and "pwn"

and, you're not restricting anyone else, because the drok runners usually level up(eventually) and putting it on LA would be good, because it would reduce what few rushes leave from LA

i dont think there should be a level restriction.but maybe if you have those skills on your bar you cant enter the arena

edit: oh yeah armor too

Lebdan · Sep 03, 2005, 02:25 AM // 02:25

I'll have to resurrect this topic again. I'm sorry but I won't sit with crossed arms while this kind of stuff still happens. Even if it means posting just to keep the thread on the first page so it's easily read by the devs.

Warskull · Sep 03, 2005, 04:38 AM // 04:38

The best solution would be to lock armor levels in the lower level arenas. In ascalon arena and yak's bend your armor levels are locked at the medium armor (30 for most classes, not sure of exact number for warriors.) If you have weaker armor it is boosted to that level and better armor is reduced. As for the skills, just throwing an error message saying that you can't enter the arena with elites on your skillbar.

You can't have it perfectly balanced in the lower level arenas, but you can at least limit the advantage twinks get. The PvP arenas aren't meant to be competitive until you hit the lvl 20 arenas, before that it is susposed to be an introduction to PvP for players.

Additionally make the LA arena 15-20 PvE only and create a 20 with max armor arena in Amnoon. It really sucks when you want to get a few decent PvP rounds in and you get players low level players on your team who are promptly massacred. It isn't any fun playing against them either.

NiGht_HaWk · Sep 03, 2005, 05:12 AM // 05:12

I have a better suggestion which i think would work well.

For the Ascalon Arena, make it so that any armor or skills you could possibly unlock from yaks bend on is restricted. For example. If a level 6 had yaks bend armor or better, they would not be allowed into the ascalon arena. Same for skills. If a level 8 ranger had Poison arrow equipped they would not be allowed until they remove that skill from their skill bar.

Same idea for Shiverpeak Arena, the limit there would be lions arch.

etc. etc.

Some may think its too restrictive, since it basically kills all runners by making them make a choice between uber leet armor/skills or arena play. But its the only way to make the arenas equally fair, which is what Anet has been striving to do the whole time: Equality in gameplay.

QuixotesGhost · Sep 03, 2005, 12:57 PM // 12:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by NiGht_HaWk

I have a better suggestion which i think would work well.

For the Ascalon Arena, make it so that any armor or skills you could possibly unlock from yaks bend on is restricted. For example. If a level 6 had yaks bend armor or better, they would not be allowed into the ascalon arena. Same for skills. If a level 8 ranger had Poison arrow equipped they would not be allowed until they remove that skill from their skill bar.

Same idea for Shiverpeak Arena, the limit there would be lions arch.

etc. etc.

Some may think its too restrictive, since it basically kills all runners by making them make a choice between uber leet armor/skills or arena play. But its the only way to make the arenas equally fair, which is what Anet has been striving to do the whole time: Equality in gameplay.

The problem here is that it's definatly possible to get to Yak's Bend and beyond under level 10 just through normal play.

Shin Shadowbane · Sep 03, 2005, 09:44 PM // 21:44

I agree entirely! The low level PvP Arena's are totally screwed. They are NO fun because you can't go 2 matches in a row without running into some jerk wearing Drok's armor and/or using elites or using freaking Apply Poison to wipe out the entire opposing team in less than a minute!

This is outright ABUSIVE and Unfair. I have posted other threads to this fact on other websites, that ANET says they are monitoring. Everyone needs to sound off on this so we can get this problem fixed. A lot of good, reasonable suggestions have been made to fix this issue, all it takes is someone in charge to listen and take action.

ANET are you listening? Apparently I am not the only *crazy* person who thinks this is an issue. Why don't some of you developers grab a low level character and go to the Ascalon Arena and see how long it takes for you to get Poisoned or to run into Drok armor. I don't care how skilled you are, you will most likely get owned in seconds coming across these skills when you only have 200-260 health. Remember, its not just ELITES and high AL that is a problem, its pretty much all the skills beyond Yaks Bend.....Stinking Apply Poison....getting real tired of that one.